Doesn't even make me blink. People got around so much more than we think they did. It's amazing how many ancients knew about the Western Hemisphere. The Chinese traded with those who traded with Rome and much of the frankincense used in the Jewish temple came from the East. That Chinese explorers ended up in Britain isn't as crazy as it may first appear. They may well have thought that "home" was beyond the Straits of Heracles and across the ocean, who knows? I'd love to read their stories, but they most likely reached Jerusalem through the Frankincense Trail and continued on to either Greece or Rome, then on to Britain with the legions. It could have taken them years.
Cold Steel
JoinedPosts by Cold Steel
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What were two Chinese doing in Roman London?
by fulltimestudent inin the ancient world, people moved around much more than we may have expected, (think of paul's reported journeys and those of his supporters), but the identification of two skeletons in a roman era burial ground, as chinese has surprised historians.. the uk bbc reports: .
dr rebecca redfern, curator of human osteology at the museum of london, told bbc radio 4's the world at one, the find was "the first time in roman britain we've identified people with asian ancestry" and it was "absolutely phenomenal".. http://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-37452287.
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What Must One Do To Get Baptized?
by Cold Steel inthe scriptures teach one must be baptized i the name of the father, son and holy spirit.
how do the jws baptize and what must one do to receive it?
also, if all baptized members become ordained ministers, does that mean they can baptize their own converts?
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Cold Steel
But do they? Every day Armageddon is one day closer, and this has been going on for a very long time. If it was close in 1974, imagine how close it is now!
Can you feel the excitement growing within you?
Well, probably not. And that's the problem with the WTS. A spinning top will spin only so long. But new tops are being spun each day and some tops stopped spinning some time ago! That means tops stop spinning each day as well. And there are many wobbling tops that are nearly worn out. The people near death who thought they would never die must think about it. The youthful smugness is gone and eternity opens wide to receive them. My grandmother was no JW, but she was influenced by their doctrines and had looked forward to seeing my departed grandfather in the spirit realm. But after reading some Watchtowers, she feared she would go to the grave, cease to exist and she grew to fear it. Yet my JW relatives thought her knowing "the truth" would comfort her when, in fact, it terrified her.
For some reason the old frequently fear death more than the young. And when one is told that millions now living will never die, and they heard it when they were young, it would certainly cause me to rethink things. I'm sure, though, that there are many new members who are feeling the same excitement that the end is near. Makes me wonder at what point they do care?
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Are Gods true worshippers on Earth today? If they are not JWs then who are they?
by Formerbrother inis there gods true worshipers on earth today as jesus said there would be?
if they are not jws then who are they?.
who else comes close to being gods true followers today?.
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Cold Steel
LisaRose, perhaps you're reading too much into it. FormerBrother never said, "Hey, if the JWs are wrong, who's right?" I know some JWs use that reasoning, thinking that their doctrines are so unassailably correct that they must win by default, but they're far from correct. And they use it to comfort themselves into believing the WTS is "The Truth" because they can't get any confirmation from God, so they lean on the dictates of men. "They draw near me with their lips, and with their mouths they do honor me, but their hearts are far from me." (Isaiah 29)
Butt FB never used the argument. He merely asked for opinions. I didn't get the impression he was defending the Society, just asking for alternatives. I might be wrong, but with a handle like "FormerBrother," he may just be asking a question.
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By Way of Announcement, Darlene Jefferson Has Been Disfellowshiped
by Cold Steel ini was watching a jw video where the announcement was made of a young lady's being disfellowshiped, and it happened in a regular kh sunday meeting.
this struck me as being a bit...cold.
is this when the shunning begins?
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Cold Steel
So if you go into a meeting and crawl, you have a good shot at not being DF'ed?
What happens if one simply repents of the sin and decided not to trouble the elders? If one leads a good life from then on and then dies, Yahwe will not burn him at Armageddon, will He? If no, does the person just get a little singed? Maybe a little crispy around the edges?
So why would anyone do that to themselves? Who wants to be DF'ed and treated like crap when they could keep it between themselves and God? I mean if elders can sin, keep it to themselves and repent and stay elders, why muck things up?
Here's a scenario: Bill is a faithful brother but misses his non-JW family. One Christmas he attends the family's delicious and acclaimed festive meals and his family slips him some gifts, reminding him that Jesus gave mankind the ultimate gift. (Obviously they don't know that they'll die horrible deaths at Armageddon and that they'll perish forever into oblivion.) But for now our attention is on Bill. He accepts the gifts, but not in the spirit of the pagan holiday, but as reminders of Jesus' sacrifice as his mother had said. Later, he's wracked with guilt. He saw their vile tree and the offensive ornaments and lights. He ate their putrid food (which was excellent by the way) and had even enjoyed it! What should he do? Must he report this disgusting deed to the elders? What if he doesn't? What if he attended their despicable church, the one he grew up in, to hear bible readings?
How much trouble is Bill in with Jehovah?
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What Must One Do To Get Baptized?
by Cold Steel inthe scriptures teach one must be baptized i the name of the father, son and holy spirit.
how do the jws baptize and what must one do to receive it?
also, if all baptized members become ordained ministers, does that mean they can baptize their own converts?
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Cold Steel
Thank you all for your informative answers. Blondie, you are a gold mine of information. You must have an enviable database. Too bad you're going to be destroyed with the rest of us at Armageddon. Jehovah should keep you around to help keep Him straight. (Don't get your hopes up...He won't.)
And Smiddy, thank you for your detailed info. Is one required to do service before being dunked? If I were young man and headed to a university to become an archeologist, do you think I would be counseled not to go? (Do they still do that?) And if I planned to take some theology courses in school, would I have the freedom to do that or would that be viewed negatively? Certainly they must have some trained theologians in their ranks, right? Where are they trained?
Thanks again, all. If anyone has any good baptism stories, feel free to post them. Or if you want to relate your own baptism, I'd love to hear it.
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Relationship Between the JWs and Brooklyn Coming to an End
by betterdaze inthe 107-year relationship between the jehovah’s witnesses and brooklyn is coming to an endby terence cullen sept. 21, 2016, 9:45 a.m.for jehovah’s witnesses, brooklyn heights was until recently the equivalent of vatican city for catholics.
brooklyn—“the borough of churches”—arguably has no congregation with a more noticeable presence than the witnesses.
the watch tower bible and tract society of pennsylvania, the governing body of the jehovah’s witnesses, built its headquarters at 25-30 columbia heights, and it is there to greet any visitor driving over the brooklyn bridge.
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Cold Steel
Sir82 » "We wish everybody the best as we leave. Of course, we daily pray for the moment, very soon now, when Jesus Christ and a horde of resurrected ex-Bethelite spirit creatures will annihilate nearly every man, woman, and child in Brooklyn. But until that day comes when men, women, toddlers & infants are writhing in agony at their painful & violent deaths, well, hey, all the best."
You are going to writhe for that one!
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Are Gods true worshippers on Earth today? If they are not JWs then who are they?
by Formerbrother inis there gods true worshipers on earth today as jesus said there would be?
if they are not jws then who are they?.
who else comes close to being gods true followers today?.
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Cold Steel
FormerBrother » Is there Gods true worshipers on Earth today as Jesus said there would be? If they are not JWs then who are they? Who else comes close to being Gods true followers today?
Are you asking if there's a true church on Earth? Because many people worship God on this world though they believe different doctrines and view the Bible differently. It would be an error in my view to consign worshippers to Hell or the grave if you wish, just because they aren't "true" believers.
As for if there's a church on Earth that was established by Jesus Christ, the three top contenders are, of course, the Catholic Church, which claims the church has continued an unbroken chain since the days of Christ. My horse in the race is the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (LDS), which claims the ancient church fell into apostasy following the deaths of the apostles. It believes the church was restored to the earth through Jesus Christ and the ministry of angels who formerly lived as apostles and prophets to a prophet named Joseph Smith. One thing in its favor, and again, this is my horse, is that there were multitudes of witnesses who saw angels, had visions and revelations with Smith, witnessed healings and attained greatness as modern apostles and prophets. Both the Catholics and LDS believe they are in possession of the keys of the kingdom, which gives the church the power to bind both in Heaven and Earth and are necessary to the work of the ministry.
The third contender, in my view, is the Seventh Day Adventists. They also believe in the great apostasy, and they believe their church was established by Jesus Christ, who revealed to Ellen G. White that Christians all over the earth are worshipping on the wrong day (Sunday), and should return to worshipping on the Seventh Day of the week (Saturday). White maintained that, through her revelations, she could identify the Pope of Rome as the prophesied Antichrist. She was the only witness to her revelations, though some witnesses her having revelations. When enrapted in vision, they said, she could not be moved from her place.
My personal belief is that the church of Christ must have revelation at its core. The Jehovah's Witnesses have never received any communication from God confirming His acceptance of them as His representational church. They assume they are God's true servants without a modicum of confirmation. To them everything is invisible and insubstantial. As far as I know, God has never operated in this manner. He had always communicated His will through revelation and through prophets.
That's my take.
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Cold Steel
When I was growing up in the 60s, I was one of the victims of bussing, a federal program that took blacks from bad neighborhoods and bussed them into good white schools in the hopes that they would benefit from it. Like all liberal policies it was a disaster. Many of the white kids, including myself, were okay with this. At first. It wasn't long before the white schools, which had been some of the best in the country, became some of the worst. Many of the black kids had slipped back one or two years and were considerably larger and more dangerous in an environment that was run, in their eyes, more like a prison than an institution of learning. Drugs began to be circulated amongst the white students and teachers were beat up in the parking lots and some humiliated by black students in class. It wasn't safe for white students (and some blacks) to go to the restrooms alone.
And it wasn't safe for female teachers to be alone in classrooms after school. One teacher, a frail and skittish fellow, had no defense from large, aggressive blacks and was frequently assaulted by them. They found him one morning in his classroom closet, hanged with his own tie. It most likely was suicide.
I had plenty of problems myself and tried to keep on the good side of these monsters and actually brought spare change to school with me, as I had learned it was better to have it and give it than to not have it. One day a goon with a head shaped like a Neanderthal came in late to an English class. Seeing there was no chair at his table, he decided to take mine and merely remove it out from under me. And the female teacher, a young waif, did nothing. I should have just left the room, but at the time I was pissed. And I immediately set out to retrieve my chair. The offending student simply turned and punched me in the chest and sent me flying onto a nearby table and scattering books. The teacher did nothing though I had the breath knocked out of me. To this day I have a lump on my chest from where he hit me. After that I began carrying makeshift weapons to school with me.
As the drug problem increased, we had at least one narcotics agent posing as a student. It led to a very large drug bust, but only served to further divide blacks and whites. One day a white student had a bad break up with his girlfriend and he was very wrought over it. As he was leaving school a largely harmless black student hit him up for some change. A disagreement ensued and Phillip, the black student, a guy I'd always gotten along with, pulled out a banana knife. In the struggle, the white student took the knife from Phillip and stuck it in his thigh narrowly missing an artery. Phillip managed to make his way to the clinic leaving a substantial blood trail.
The racial tensions nearly broke the school following the drug bust, and at one point the blacks had largely gathered on one side of the school and the whites on the other, and in between were riot cops all decked out with vests, helmets and weapons. The Black Panthers also showed up to agitate where they could. After about three horrible days of unrest, the white student who'd stabbed Phillip committed suicide in his own home using his dad's shotgun. Then the tide turned and now whites were seeking revenge by assaulting blacks.
It was years before I could see black in a positive light. I despised them as a race, I carried weapons when I went into black neighborhoods and though I never raised a fist or club against them, I was always prepared. Later, I met some great black people, made them my friends and changed my views, but it took years. In Washington, D.C., I faced down five very large black youths, and it was only because I had an illegal .38Spc revolver on me that my date and I were able to get away. I only had five shots, but my gun was loaded with a lethal specialty ammunition that alone would have sent me to prison. So I'm glad they backed off. I don't carry in D.C. anymore, but I don't park in underground garages anymore at night, either, and the only reason I did so then was because we were attending a play at Arena Stage and we visited one of the actors afterwards. After we left, the place looked like a war zone. Everything was locked up with steel bars. And looking back I'm glad I was armed, but had it not been for the (largely one-way) violence I saw in school during those turbulent times, I most likely never would have become a knife and gun hobbyist as I am now. It definitely affected me for most of my life.
It also made me a conservative.
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What Must One Do To Get Baptized?
by Cold Steel inthe scriptures teach one must be baptized i the name of the father, son and holy spirit.
how do the jws baptize and what must one do to receive it?
also, if all baptized members become ordained ministers, does that mean they can baptize their own converts?
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Cold Steel
The scriptures teach one must be baptized I the name of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit. How do the JWs baptize and what must one do to receive it? Also, if all baptized members become ordained ministers, does that mean they can baptize their own converts? When one sees all those photos of people being baptized at the conferences or conventions, who is it who is doing the baptizing? Regular members? Elders? Can women baptize? And do you absolutely need baptism to be received into God's Kingdom or is it only the anointed class who need it?
Also, if one is disfellowshiped, does that require re-baptism? Can they do anything to you that would require re-baptism?
What if you wanted to baptize your son or daughter, so you teach them and then baptize them in the Jordan River when you take a family vacation to the Holy Land? Would that baptism be recognized by God according to JW belief?
Finally, does each baptism have to be fully witnessed by two duly appointed witnesses (small "w")? Where are the forms filled and can you volunteer to be a Baptist...er...Baptizer?
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JW Literature Trolleys Don't Carry the Book Of Mormon
by Athanasius inthis morning the jws set up two literature trolleys at our local shopping centre.
the trolleys were situated within 20 feet of each other with six jws attending them.
why they needed six jws on hand i have no idea as everyone was ignoring them.. anyway i thought i'd have some fun.
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Cold Steel
Do they still actively try to get people to take Bible courses? I've asked people who have been visited by JWs if they were offered Bible study. So far everyone has said no, they were just handed some literature and that was it. In my neighborhood they come in cars and unload, then they meet back up in about an hour and head out for lunch (I'm guessing).
They've never ask about Bible study.
What's goin' on?
Laziness or policy?